Hello, I want to thank everyone who has been contributing to the discussion on TCI or spreading the word - and that would be nearly all of the `writers' on TCI. I also would like to thank the `comment' participators too - `Robin' has been a WOW quite worthy of a full read with his insights too.
As the moderator for TCI - today I'd like to cover the seed post of this week and comments about my own comments too. Let me begin: (First a wrap up of Ghosts - seed post 2.)
On 8-6 commentor `Robin's' post was escalated to the front posting page and with good reason - he directly quotes Bruce D and Me from our comments (we want this to be a discussion) and then brings thru Aleister Crowley to support his views/thoughts - this is exactly the type of discussion that Bruce and I want to stimulate. Especially quotes like this:
Whatever else one can say about Crowley, one of the things that I do find admirable about him is his agnostic/scientific approach to all (or most) matters spiritual and "supernatural." Like here, he tells you right up front that this is only his "Opinion" , not to be taken as dogmatic truth.
Exactly Robin. NONE of us know, but we can think out strong possibilities that seem to fit our experiences or consensus ideas.
Then, Robin - finishes off Seed Post Two of Lee's with words to remember- first his main post comment:
But I have to say real quick that I don't think this explains all ghost, poltergeist and other assorted paranormal phenomena, because what Crowley was talking about - what you guys were talking about - was the afterlife, and what might happen in that after-world, so we're talking about "ghosts" more specifically of the "human kind" , which, if any of the above is close to the truth, I think is a pretty good guess at part of what's going on here. But I think we obviously must, definitely must, keep the notion of inter-dimesional type beings or entities, of the kind of which you've had some personal experience (and other types), in the discussion as well. Because, I mean, how can a person really tell if he or she is really seeing a ghost? It could be some inter-dimesional type being appearing to them, and really, how would they know the difference?
Then his quote about my Post on Seed 2:
'No', said the man. 'It is only what we bring over, or send over beforehand, that determines what this place will be for us.'
Excellent stuff Robin. (Do you have a blog?)
But, to wrap up Seed Post 2 - Eric Ouellet – Adding to Phillips on ‘Death State’ - Added: (Welcome Eric):
The vision of medical doctors around one while being in NDE is far from being a straight-forward one. Did it occur “during” the actual event, or was it retro-cognition (a known phenomenon) occurring at the time when one “comes back”? There are absolutely no ways to know which of the two is at play in such cases, but we have some serious empirical data about retro-cognition (particularly research about psychic detectives used by police forces when they have no other lead available). In light of such knowledge, albeit a limited one, there are still better explanations about NDEs than the one about “departing souls.”
Excellent point Eric - reminds me of the on-going experiment to try to have NDE's say a number (or something like that) that is on the top of a cabinet out of sight in the operating room to `prove' the `soul separation' - and reminds me of this near current link by Michael Prescott in his blog http://michaelprescott.typepad.com/michael_prescotts_blog/2010/08/an-nde-to-sink-your-teeth-into.html
That said, my point Eric was to `bring data' (what market researchers want) to the table for examination.
Seed Post 2 turned into a excellent discussion on The C Influence - thanks to everyone involved.
Then, on Aug. 8th - Duensing posted Seed Post 3 about one of his ideas about reality - Harmonics.
The concept of a photon based adaptation versus a harmonic visualization and simulation of what lies outside the sheath of a somatic shell, as well as the quantized and decidedly human based measurement of "intelligence" is also called up for examination. ......Gurdjieff's more specific reformulation. It is as if we as being a portion of the whole, also experience waveforms of resonance that seemingly make one sense that there are degrees of sleep in wakefulness, just as there are degrees of wakefulness in our dream states that are unspoken, non directed, and beyond self awareness of their origin.....A sense that does not require the senses, to us, makes no sense and yet, like a carrier wave either weakly or intensely felt, these nearly subliminal predispositions may be due the harmonics of our state and stations in relation to both the empirical and the unseen, much like a transceiver and transformer either stepping up or stepping down a energetic wave that is, if all this is true, decidedly non local in it's origin, and yet resonates in the intuition, the heart and in the instinctual. A non verbal form of communication. ....In my research over decades, one provocative notation that appears again and again as an "adjective" for the observers connection to an anomalous event, whether intentional or a matter of happenstance is the pre-existing emotional tenor of the experiencer, either expressed subliminally as a anticipation or overtly in a traumatic dynamic, this much appears to be true as a contingency, that the harmonics as expressed in the composition of the observer seem to act as a transceiver, an overriding factor or bias, superimposing itself in the logic of the intellect....the role of childhood, or again the environmental factors that lead to an attenuation much like a sensory extension akin to a sensitivity of human harmonics that is developed, and or perhaps even "encouraged" by a sensitivity or empathy for life in the general rather in the specific....Why do I use the term harmonic?
I use the term because I think it more than likely a recombinant dynamic of factors as a pre-existing modality must be in place before such anomalies occur. ....So the congealing of many factors arise in an event. I have taken this approach to Ufology as it most definitely has a "psychic" component which is much more complex than the current subject. if applied to the realm above dreams and imagination, one can nearly sense a realm where the bottom is actualized by the top and the top is actualized by the bottom. In other words, an intermediary world where delimited potentiality meets the tumbler as a key, this form of a non sensate organic nature that has unlimited variation much like a fractal arrangement that grows from the self organizing cellular manifestation as well as from a catalog that is literally infinite, as it is perpetually differentiating. One wonders if situations that we encounter have a similar counterpart, that does not require our logic as a measuring device to exist.....I have taken this approach to Ufology as it most definitely has a "psychic" component which is much more complex than the current subject.
Wow Bruce, where to begin - First, I can concur 100% that some `paranormal events' are seemingly the result of what I call `beckoning the unknown' - I've experienced it, many many others have - and frankly - it FITS what seems to be happening nowadays with `Orb' or UFO `callers' (indeed, there is data from the 1950-1960's that I've linked to in the past that showed UFO's would `respond' to thoughts).
Also, your Gurdijeff comments are dead on to me too with - "waveforms of resonance" - certainly could involve `specialized awareness of a school of thought' IMO - which could indeed be a set-up for non-ordinary thoughts or non-ordinary reality events. That `deputy steward' being activated as The Fourth Way says - is vital for understanding of ones real level of awareness potential.
And, finally, I want to respond to the many comments and postings since Seed Post 3 started.
First - was Bruceleeeowe's comment/Post - I've something to say about the phenomenon. These phenomenon really, are intriguing and yet to be unexplained for science. But I think, not so often, that this could be some sort of virtual reality or may be real virtuality. Both are discriminate phenomenon. It could be just some sort of codex which is processed and parsed by our biogital brain. See my post on this
At the link Leeeowe lays out why paranormal events may be `caused' by codex - that could indeed - be being supplied outside of our own system of our own reality - a computer software if you will. And I for one - am NOT ready to dismiss the possibilitiy that EVERYTHING we see actualized may indeed be a software projection of some sort.
Then, came Robin's comment/post - http://thecinfluenceblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/tci-sp3-reader-robin-actualizes.html
Ah yes, Sheikh Al-Akbar, The Greatest Sheikh, Ibn Al-Arabi, is definitely, I think, potentially a very fruitful area of investigation if we are going to speak of, as you say, "Worlds that exist and yet are non-manifest." Henry Corbin's book, Alone With The Alone: Creative Imagination in the Sufism of Ibn 'Arabi, and some his other books,(not to mention Arabi's own writings themselves), contain some very interesting and in depth looks at some of these "intermediary worlds" ,
I love your thinking style and effort Robin - way to stay on topic.
importance of "the heart as the most developed sensory organ whose vast abundance of embedded nerves, is second only to the mind itself." The Sufis call the heart an "organ of perception" , and with Science telling us that there is an abundance of neurons in the heart as well as the brain, maybe the Sufis are right.
Neurons in the heart is new to me - thanks.
And in my research as well, as you say, "one provocative notation appears again and again" , that being, "the pre-existing emotional tenor of the experiencer." And this goes for any type of experience, from the "mystical" to the "supernatural" to the "paranormal" or what have you, emotions seem to play an important function in all this. As an example from Mysticism, we have the Sufi Dhikr Ceremony, in which music, chanting/singing, movements and dance, together with the overall environment, are all designed and used to bring the participants emotions and energy level to the highest pitch possible, and therefore, hopefully, ideally, launch the participant, the Dervish, into some heavy mystical experience, or some type of "altered state of consciousness." I'm sure the reader can think of examples from other traditions around the world where this technique is used.
This reminds me greatly of creating a non-ordinary consensus - like the ideas of Casteneda.
Next came Regan - with - http://thecinfluenceblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/tci-sp3-lee-actualizes-discussion-on.html
Bruce’s eloquent thoughts on harmonics and the symbiotic dance/play/relationship between us and anomalous events reminds us of the obvious, cliché yet taken for granted fact that our particular culture continues to separate mind/heart/consciousness, rejecting the idea of an “other” even existing at all. As Bruce and Robin, in her/his comments, have pointed out, our emotions, our “pre-existing emotional tenor” (Robin) is part of our perceptions of mystical, paranormal, etc. events. Many cultures recognize this and induce these states through sounds, and movement (chanting, music, dance) as has been pointed out by Robin and Bruce. Energies are both physical and emotional. I had this experience with a healer who used sound; singing bowls and her own unique, weird “singing” almost a kind of yowling... that literally shifted things in my body. Paranormal experiences contain these responses to “unseen” energies we call ghosts, spirits, psychic insights -- and in cases of UFOs, at times, aliens? -- the physical, strong electrical feelings felt in my body when in the presence of these kinds of phenomena
Once again, for me, these words echo the `setting up' of the paranormal via expectations of `a shift'. And, thanks Regan for bringing it into the `first person'.
Energy, seen, unseen. Physical, always, regardless. Shifted, moved, manipulated by sound, movement. And, others? Are the Djinn, aliens, spirits, aware of this as well -- more so? -- and move the energy waves around us, as well as within us, to create what they want to create, for either our benefit, their benefit, or some combination of both?
I think it depends on the quality and type of anomalous thing present.
Another comment - dead on topic.
this happened a couple of years ago: I had been working very strongly with intent, a lot of work on focusing, energy --- and had the following experience, which sounds both downright silly, as well as trivial. But even in this trivial, mundane every day setting, the powerful illustration of energy-shifting was evident.
I was in line at the bank. Woman ahead of me was just... bothering me, for some reason. I couldn't even see her face, so why was she bothering me? She wasn't doing anything, just standing there. But I was getting the strongest, most uncomfortable -- and electrical -- feeling from her, "vibes," in short, that were physically affecting me. I decided I wanted her to move. Move away, move ahead. I focused/thought very intently and suddenly, I heard a lot snap/pop in my head that was accompanied by a flash of bright white light, and she, at the same time, not only moved, but kind of lunged ahead, as if someone had pushed her. She kind of looked around a little, like she had tripped, or couldn't figure out what happened.
Wonderful event to share - thanks - interesting. Thought provoking. Indeed, so thought provoking as to elicit 4 comments.
Robin said - But on the theme of "resonance" , I was reading something earlier that reminded me of what Eric just said in his most recent post, about the fact that "to have psi effects everyone has to be mentally and emotionally on the same page", and, "For group analytics to work, all the participants must 'resonate' together..."
"In summary, the theory holds that there is a certain element in the human being that strives toward perfection...When it comes into contact with a correct source of conduction - a teacher -it feeds itself for a time on this knowledge. This is the phase of attachment to the teacher. If the teacher accepts the pupil, he will first of all teach interchange concentration exercises. In these the mutual bond is strengthened. The next step is for the teacher to induce the students to interchange with one another, which they do by meeting regularly and all taking an interest in some common theme. They may think they are learning something from that theme. In fact, they are becoming attuned to one another."
Mir S Khan - The King's Son pgs. 152-153
Again Robin - I am so impressed with your staying on topic and providing the quote - thanks. AND, for tieing it all into C `school' influence. Wow.
I just wanted add something here about what you were saying in the last paragraph. I, too, have experienced a "loud pop/snap sound in my head, accompanied by a bright flash of light." It's happened maybe half a dozen or so times throughout my life, usually when I'm laying in bed trying to go to sleep. The first time it happened, I thought, "What the hell? Am I having a stroke or something?" .....Anyway, if anybody knows, or has any ideas on what that loud pop/snap sound accompanied by the bright flash of light might be, I'd sure like to hear about it.
Then, actualizing discussion - Lee responded:
Robin, I've had the same experience you've described (light flashes, popping sounds) many times. Had one the other night in fact.....the light flashes and sounds happen in bed, when I'm going to sleep, and sometimes I get a jerky feeling too, like I'm leaving my body. So I think it's OOBE related.....My experience in line with the woman in front of me; that was a bit different, but then again, I've never had that happen before, so who can say. If the "brain explosions" are related to out of body experiences, maybe it is the same, or, related.
I think you are both brave for sharing these events on TCI - I expect that shared paranormal to be a natural thing around TCI.
The fourth comment was also again by Robin - actualizing discussion again:
And now that you mention it, I do recall reading something, somewhere, about the "pop/snap" sound being connected with Astral Projection and OOBE's. But speaking from my own experience, I've had one spontaneous OOBE in my life, not "near-death" (although they're pretty much the same thing, except you're not dying), as I was comfortably relaxed in bed at the time, reading a book. I won't go into the details, but no popping or snapping or sound of any other kind occured. I only remember sweet silence and perfect awareness
Anyone wanna bet that `sweet silence and perfect awareness' draws a comment from Colucci?
And, I hope readers didn't miss Eric's comments about Harmonics - http://thecinfluenceblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/tci-sp3-ouellet-actualizes-discussion.html :
A similar notion exists in the field of group analytics, which actually refers to group psychoanalysis. This psychological school of thought and practice, created out of the work of S.H. Foulkes (with the participation of the renowned sociologist Norbert Elias, among others), aims at exploring the social unconscious of the group so that the analyst can help them with their personal challenges. Practitioners of this approach also use the expression “resonance” to explain how to access this intangible social unconscious. For group analytics to work, all the participants must “resonate” together to find out what negative and destructive socially shared beliefs or views is alienating them. The same process can be used to have them embrace other socially shared beliefs or views that are much more positive and progressive...
To me, the above by Eric is what TCI will be best at - the bringing of thoughtful minds of different takes into the mix.
In the larger scale social realm, this process is called the “social construction of reality” and can be seen as a matter of harmonics too. What is important, meaningful, acceptable, and ultimately “real” is matter of collective consensus in societies.
To me, real in this sense - does not relate to phenomenology except that it may be what permits `actions' of a certain tenor to occur.
the world of parapsychology, it is also possible to extend the notion of resonance to group experiments. The landmark studies conducted by Kenneth Batcheldor and Owen & Sparrow (the famous Philip Experiment) show that to have group psi effects everyone has to be mentally and emotionally on the same page. This very notion of resonance as descriptor of social dynamics might be applicable to larger groups as well, as the experiences conducted by the Global Consciousness Projects might have shown. Their best case is certainly the higher degree of synchronization of about 20 Random Number Generators (RNG) scattered around the globe a few hours before 9/11.
To me Eric - what happened to the data eggs in the Noosphere experiment on 9-11 are the BEST EXAMPLE OF PARANORMAL IN EXISTENCE - http://noosphere.princeton.edu/terror.html A statement I do not make lightly.
Notions like resonance and harmonics remain, of course, metaphors, or more appropriately explanatory structures. They are not reality itself but representations of realities. Yet, as we used them they become reality, a reality that is much more interesting to contemplate as it offers new and promising avenues of investigation.
Welcome aboard Eric.
Finally, Duensing returned with Part Two to Harmonics - http://thecinfluenceblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/duensing-actualizes-harmonics-of.html - already with a comment - and will be my next post.
Oh, ALL WRITERS WHO HAVE NOT RETURNED THE LIST OF POSSIBLE TOPICS - PLEASE PLEASE DO SO TODAY.